Talk:Xavier Nady

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[edit] Xavier Nady Song

A song called "The Ballad of X" by a group called "Kuff and the Buttheads" is a tribute to Xavier Nady's short stint with the New York Mets. For some time a reference to the song existed in the trivia section of Xavier Nady's wikipedia article. Recently the trivia was deleted because it was deemed irrelevant, and had no pertinence to Xavier Nady's baseball career. I disagree, and I was told to air my argument on this discussion board. I would assume that the majority of people reading Xavier Nady's wikipedia entry would be Xavier Nady fans and thus would be delighted to learn that a song about him exists, and can be found on the internet. Several biographical entries on Wikipedia include references to songs written about the biographical subjects, but for some reason, whether it be the relative unpopularity of the song, this reference was deleted. Please post to let me know if you agree that at least a reference, and not a link, to the song should exist on Xavier Nady's Wikipedia entry, since the song is a tribute to Xavier and thus holds relevance in relation to his baseball career. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.52.58.130 (talk • contribs) .

For one this wiki page won't be just for Xavier Nady fans but for anybody looking for information on Xavier Nady/Pittsburgh Pirates. It is because wikipedia is an open and free encyclopedia that a neutral point of view must be adhered to at all times. Bias is for blogs and fan pages. If you are going to post that he has a tribute song then I would highly suggest adding references/citation for this. If it has been removed before it might be because the band is not very notable (doesn't have it's own wikipedia page), can't be verified, or it was posted and did not conform to NPOV. When citing sources please keep in mind that a blog is usually not an acceptable reference. Wikipedia:Citing sources, Wikipedia:Reliable sources, and Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons should help you in finding the proper source. Hope this helps. --ImmortalGoddezz 18:02, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

My feelings are that the song itself is not particularly relevant to Nady, since there is no evidence to believe that the song is of particular public significance, either to Nady or to the community of baseball fans at large. Further, Nady's no longer with the Mets and is now with the Pirates, further reducing the significance of the song. I do not believe that the reference to the song belongs. --Nlu (talk) 20:25, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

If the song has the proper sources, and reliable ones (Not myspace), I don't see what the problem with keeping the references to the song in. This wiki page is about the baseball player Xavier Nady, not just Xavier Nady while he was with the Pittsburgh Pirates. I believe until proper references are found the information should be deleted as per WP:BIO, if proper referencing is found then I don't have a problem with it being in. As the original poster said plenty of other pages have references to songs that were composed for them. See: List of songs about famous people. --ImmortalGoddezz 14:07, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

I took a look at the MySpace page. The group that created the song is not itself notable. With that being the case, I think inserting reference to the song basically is vanity and spam. --Nlu (talk) 16:38, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

When did Wikipedia become the judge and jury as to what constitutes a notable band? There are several bands out there that neither myself nor you have probably ever heard of, yet this does not make them non notable. The song in question here was written by a Met fan whom I would suppose is also a big fan of Xavier Nady's. Xavier Nady, as you have pointed out before, only played as a Met for a short time, yet during that short time, 75 games to be exact, he managed to endear himself to Mets fans, who admired and respected him for his hard work and his laid back, easy going attitude. He was referred to as the X-Man by his manager, his teammates and New York Metropolitan fans. During his time in New York, he contributed several clutch hits which led to victories for the New York Mets. His trade was the result of a freak cab accident involving Duaner Sanchez, which Kuff and the Buttheads mention in the song, and the majority of Met fans were dismayed and upset by the trade. Xavier himself alluded to being frustrated with the trade in several interviews, having gone from a first place team headed to the playoffs to a last place team that has long occupied the cellar of the National league. The song echoes that frustration, and stands as an ode to Xavier's time with the Mets and his sad departure from the Mets. I understand removing the link to the song, as I am sure it probably violates some wikipedia rule, but removing the trivia itself does a grave disservice to fans of Baseball, Xavier Nady and loyal wikipedia readers worldwide.

Fatthand9 02:10, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

You're here on Wikipedia, and you have to play by Wikipedia's rules. Whatever other communities, online or otherwise, might judge as notable or not notable, here on Wikipedia, the community of Wikipedians judge by Wikipedia's standards what's notable and what's not notable. You don't get to dictate to us. --Nlu (talk) 04:37, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Request for Comment: Xavier Nady song

This is a dispute as to the inclusion of a song about Xavier Nady on his Wikipedia page

Statements by editors previously involved in dispute

• Though only appearing in a New York Mets uniform for a brief 75 games, Nady proved popular enough with local fans to inspire a song "Ballad of the X" documenting his short time with the team.Fatthand9 17:59, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

• 07:28, 7 September 2006 Nlu (Talk | contribs) m (re-re-revert after some thought; as it stands, it is effectively spam and link to non-notable band)

Comments

• I, Fatthand9, agreed with Nlu that the link should be removed but disagreed with him, arguing that the mention of the song should stay.
• Nlu countered that the band was not notable and the song bore no relevance to his career as a baseball player, and thus should be striked from the page.

Argument

• It is my belief that a mention of this song should be included in Nady's biography because it echoes the fans frustration at his sudden surprising trade from the Mets, as well as providing a brief, somewhat exaggerated, chronicle of his time with the Mets, therefore it bears relevance to his career as a baseball player.
• Furthermore, Wikipedia's standards on what is and is not notable are very cloudy and the ultimate decision rests on the Wikipedia community.
• Wikipedia provides the perfect medium for trivia such as this, a rare, yet extremely passionate ode to a slugging rightfielder, to be disseminated. With so few songs about modern baseball players, it is encouraging to know that some exist, and "The Ballad of X" deserves a mention on this page.

17:59, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Saw the RFC and came on by and here's my take: The song should be included only if 1) it is by a band which meets the Wikipedia inclusion requirements of WP:MUSIC or 2) the song has been mentioned in mainstream media coverage of Nagy. Gamaliel 19:13, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Another RFC response. It is necessary to source the statement about the song to a reliable source. Myspace is not a reliable source. Blogs are not reliable sources. Absent any evidence of reliable sourcing, any statement about the song can be removed. If there is reliable sourcing, the issue is one for a consensus of editors, and I decline to comment upon that at this time, since I see above no evidence of reliable sourcing. I will, however, note that the citation should be to the reliable source, and that any link to the song should adhere to the guidelines at Wikipedia:External links. It is possible that a link to the song could meet those tests; a link to the performers website generally would certainly not meet those guidelines. GRBerry 22:12, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

The inclusion of this song by a band that likely flunks WP:BAND due to minor notability in some blogs is pretty clear cut band vanity and should be removed from the page. Wikipedia does not exist to publicize some song. youngamerican (ahoy-hoy) 03:31, 9 September 2006 (UTC)