Talk:Street layout of Seattle
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[edit] Kirkland and Renton
On the Kirkland thing: not a big deal, but if anyone were to be using this as a reference source for navigation (unlikely), they could be seriously confused by Kirkland's dual-grid system, which leads people to get lost fairly regularly (unlike Bellevue and Redmond, which, as far as I remember, have no other grid). Maybe just nix it, as the sentence already falls to mention plenty of other suburbs which use the numbering system? Radicalsubversiv 02:13, 14 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Renton now uses its own grid system which is unfortunately orthogonal to the system used in Seattle and unincorporated King County. Issaquah, I believe, has also made a similar change. --Wac 17:43, 7 Aug 2004 (UTC)
Copied from article verbatim:
Addressing in Seattle (and throughout King County) keeps a uniform numbering plan. On streets that run north and south, odd numbered addresses are on the west side of the street with even to the east. <!-- is that true even south of downtown? -->
- Provisional answer: "in Seattle (and throughout King County)", though ref. not yet cited.
[edit] Style
+, cit, so cl, rephrased; see Talk. MoS
Added verified relevant text and added citations, so cleaned up and rephrased as needed, per Wikipedia:Manual of Style (WP:MoS). Existing writing was retained as much as could. Summary per Wikipedia:Edit summary legend. --GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Grid layout and arterials defined are referenced by neighborhoods articles. (ToC should generate automatically with more than three headings (TOC).)
+ "street grid layout" for search engine key phrase permutations.
(SW) does not link to particular relevance to article. Replaced with northeast.
Compass points as such do not have periods, as, for example neither does NATO or the element Al. [Chicago Style, Wikipedia Boxing the compass and Cardinal direction ]. Ordinal points are single words. The official designations on maps and on actual official street signs use the standard convention. The official designations in USPS addresses use the standard convention. Another way to think of this may be to consider the compass points as symbols ilke those of the Periodic Table.
Where is "/" a good grammatical character?
Recommendation by WP:MoS: Slashes. --GoDot 06:33, 11 May 2006 (UTC) (Ed. --05:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC))
Avoid joining two words by a slash, as it suggests that they are related, but does not say how. Spell it out to avoid ambiguities. Also, the construct and/or is awkward outside of legalese. Use "x or y, or both," to explicitly conjoin with the inclusive or, or "either x or y, but not both," to explicitly specify the exclusive or.
"Include the punctuation mark inside the quotation marks only if the sense of the punctuation mark is part of the quotation" (WP:MoS#Quotation marks).
--GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
See also Talk:Seattle, Citing sources.
"External Links" -> "Further Reading", per MoS Further reading/external links.
"Retrieved [date]", since on-line reference links can break (per Embedded links). --GoDot 06:33, 11 May 2006 (UTC) --GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
{{Citation needed}} noted where needed to distinguish from citation following.
Delete <!-- whatever --> in article when okay.
Bug: ref="multiple, [name]" command per Multiple uses DNF ((Does Not Function, acronym). Kludge: "ref" command used instead, duplicates in "References" section use http://URL only.
Citations may refer to Bibliography, manually generated. Format per MoS. (Ed. --GoDot 05:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC))
--GoDot 06:33, 11 May 2006 (UTC)
- Bug: ref="multiple, Samson", etc. DNF (Does Not Function).
See Wikipedia:Footnotes and Wikipedia:Citing sources specific links above and also the "Style" section in Talk:Seattle, Citing sources. - A further explication is provided at the "See 'Style' section in", preceding paragraph, rather than multiple postings of the same text. (Above addendum (edited) was pending this next cycle of edits : ) --GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Accuracy
Jesus Christ MSUP, "six alphabetic pairs"? What is the alphabetic pattern? "JCMSUP" for search engine key word. Does anyone know a good device for remembering the order within each pair?
What is the relation of "Metro Memories Scrapbook" to the article? The page seems to be testimonials by bus patrons.
[edit] Street grid layout
For all I know, the section on street grid layout may be accurate, but it is almost indecipherable. Admittedly, I'm tired, it's late, and I'm about to call it a night, but even knowing the city well it is unclear what areas it is saying are oriented which way. It's the kind of passage where I feel like I know less when I finish than when I started. Could someone consider rewriting, or adding a map? - Jmabel | Talk 05:39, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
- Samson, Karl. "Frommer's: Seattle (Orientation)". Samson's selection from Samson, Karl (2006). Frommer's Seattle 2006. The text of this section was pre-existing, I added source reference.
- See article, section Street grid layout. Added =Why=. --GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC) (Ed. --05:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC))
[edit] Speaking of incoherence
In the Notes and references section, there is an HTML comment "Bug: ref='multiple, [name]' DNF". I have no idea what this might mean, and I doubt I am uniquely ignorant. Would someone please explain this or reword it coherently? It seems to have been added as part of this edit by User:GoDot, who appears to remark on it above, but in a manner every bit as cryptic as the phrase itself. - Jmabel | Talk 05:44, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
- See addendum in "Bug: ref='multiple, Samson', etc. DNF", above. --GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
- This is a rather comical exchange :) GoDot, you do now see that I am not the only one confused by your particular style of recordkeeping? --Lukobe 06:21, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
- A unique use of footnotes I must say. First question is the need to list "Samson" no less than 4 times when <ref name=Samson>Samson</ref> on the first listing and then <ref name=Samson/> on subsequent references would have done the same thing without eating up valuable real estate.. Or are these entries just place holders until page numbers can be found? The comment quoted above is repeated every time a footnote is created and seems to add no value to the article itself. I'd suggest not including it at all, or at least translate it into a form of English. --Bobblehead 06:47, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
- This is a rather comical exchange :) GoDot, you do now see that I am not the only one confused by your particular style of recordkeeping? --Lukobe 06:21, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
I still have no idea what "Bug: ref='multiple, Samson', etc. DNF" means. OK, "DNF" is "does not function". So what? What is the bug? What is it that you are trying to do? (And if someone other than GoDot can explain this, please do, because I suspect from the foregoing that there is a better chance that I will better understand someone else's explanation.) - Jmabel | Talk 03:02, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
Now I see (but only by looking at article history). Dead links have been removed from references. May I suggest reading Wikipedia:Citing sources#What to do when a reference link "goes dead"? It's pretty clear on what to do, and this isn't it. Once you've thrown away a link, there is very little chance that someone will reproduce it from the Web Archive, unless (as I just did) the excavate the history, which they shouldn't have to do. - Jmabel | Talk 03:19, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
- Nope, I was wrong. The link is perfectly good. I see no problem at all, other than the failure to use "name=" in the references, which is easily fixed by editing. - Jmabel | Talk 03:26, 24 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Style
A References section, which contains only citations, helps readers to see at a glance the quality of the references used. (WP: Citing sources # "References" section in addition to "Notes")
Seattle neighborhoods reference this article, so {{Seattle neighborhoods}} would be useful since this article pertains.
Re. <ref>[...] [pdf note]</ref>
NB: "streetclassmaps.htm#pdfnote" is an editorial note enclosed in square brackets, a reference within a reference. --04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC), --05:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
--GoDot 04:06, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Summary: + cite web, cl. print refs, wikify conurbation, punc pdf note, order of heads at end; see Talk
Explication: Clean up refs to print sources, make clear what the bracketed reference is. Order of headings at end per WP:MoS, 7 Standard appendices.) --GoDot 05:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
