User talk:R. Koot

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Archives
2005 (1 January – 31 December) 2006 (1 January – 31 July)

Contents 1 MediaWiki:Common.css 2 {{protected template}} 3 Re: esolangs 4 1911 template 5 Transwikiing to wikibooks... 6 Wikipedia:WikiProject Method engineering 7 Image Uploads 8 Images again... 9 SkyTeam 10 CSS 11 The Color of the boxes 12 Template:Mathematics-footer 13 {{Navigation}} 14 {{Dynamic navigation box}} 15 Template:NavigationBox 16 Image tagging for Image:Navbox-klm-after.png 17 MediaWiki edit buttons

[edit] MediaWiki:Common.css

Re [1]: I don't see any noticeable effect of that change (I did bypass the cache). If I look at the html of a page, it loads http://en.wikipedia.org/skins-1.5/monobook/main.css which already contains a hiddenStructure class (I use monobook). Could this be the reason why your change doesn't have any influence?

The idea of your change isn't bad, but I would like we convert the templates on my list first before doing this (In case you manage to make that change working :). --Ligulem 22:09, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{protected template}}

I don't agree with your changes to {{protected template}}. See for example [2]. —Ruud 06:57, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

I've reverted. --Ligulem 08:43, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Re: esolangs

There's often debate about what is and what isn't an esoteric programming language (for instance, esolang:Talk:Binary combinatory logic). As a personal opinion, I'd say Arbol definitely qualifies, not certain about Joy. You could either mention your concerns on Esolang (pretty much anywhere will do, because some Esolang users RC patrol every contribution that's made; I don't think Esolang has a Village Pump yet), or just create a stub article and see what happens. --ais523 07:52, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 1911 template

Hi _ I'm fairly sure that the template is now broken (it's not showing up because of the cache, but try it with a new instance on a new page). Can you restore it to how it was before? The wording and formating of the words are important. -- Stbalbach 16:04, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Transwikiing to wikibooks...

Please use b:WB:RFI, rather than copy-paste transwikis. --SB_Johnny|^talk|_books 11:19, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Hmm... you might want to note that at m:Help:Transwiki. —Ruud 11:26, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks... I left a note on the talk page on meta, as I wasn't sure where to put it on the main page.

BTW: are you merging that chapter with b:Programming/Hello World? There's already a chapter there. --SB_Johnny|^talk|_books 11:41, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Yikes... actually don't try to merge it. I'll announce it to the authors of the programming books and they'll know what to do with it. --SB_Johnny|^talk|_books 11:43, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia:WikiProject Method engineering

While cleaning up Category:Miscellaneous pages for deletion I found Wikipedia:WikiProject Method engineering, an apparently old, disorganized project that has left a significant mess behind. One of your subpages deals with organizing it.

The project appears to have stalled several months ago, and I feel that it is time to delete the pages that don't belong on Wikipedia, and clean up the remaining ones. I made a page for organizing this. Because you seem to have done some work regarding this in the past, I was hoping that you would be willing to help finish the job now. -- kenb215 talk 00:10, 28 October 2006 (UTC)

Hello? -- kenb215 talk 00:04, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image Uploads

Hello:

Those image uploads were from the following website. I didn't notice any copyright information on the page which influenced me to put No Rights Reserved or Copyright Free Use. [3] Their are various photos listed on this page, but the two I put on the DTW page are Exterior Photos.

[edit] Images again...

It is good to keep a consistent image size. 250px makes the image not too large and not too small.

[edit] SkyTeam

I am managing to change all related tables to the way I have changed it. It looks the best and is very simple to read. I will make sure their are no inconsistencies and flaws.

We have also had the SkyTeam template this way for a while now and you are the only person arguing with this template. It is the same template used for the Star Alliance as well as oneworld. I ask for your cooperation in keeping it the way it is. Changing the table just becuase KLM is uncalled for and should not be considered again. I have managed to change many of the boxes.

[edit] CSS

Sure I will, but, that page has many different CSS meanings, which CSS.

[edit] The Color of the boxes

Would their be any way to change the color of the box. That light purple color is so ugly!--Golich17 21:20, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Mathematics-footer

Hey there, just wondering why you reverted my changes [4] with the summary "included the cats on all pages it was transcluded on" when my version had the categories. Not quite sure I understand. --Brad Beattie ^(talk) 03:10, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{Navigation}}

Hi Rudy,

(collapsible) ... (make table-based)

Unfortunately one or other of these operations seems to've reduced the font-size used in the template body; please restore this size to its previous setting (0.9em, 90%). Thanks, David Kernow (talk) 12:48, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...Looks like it might be the "font:smaller" navbox setting. Have reverted your edits for the time being; by all means try re-implementing them if it can be done without causing this font-size reduction. Yours, David (talk) 13:17, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I notice you added new classes to Template:Dynamic navigation box. Their use is completely mysterious. Would you mind adding documentation to Wikipedia:NavFrame? —Michael Z. 2006-11-01 15:05 Z

Hi again Rudy,

Templates are still appearing with the over-reduced font-size, I'm afraid... I've just been looking at {{Countries of Europe}}, for example... I'll hold off reverting {{Navigation}} again for a while, as I realiz/se you're trying to improve it, but if no joy... Hopefully, David (talk) 18:54, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...All seems well again; thanks for any amendments made!  (Or maybe I should've purged my cache...?)  Yours, David (talk) 20:52, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...the font size has increased over here. Did you clear your browser cache?

Given the above, I think this is an example of what Jung label/led "synchronicity"...!  Chuckle, David (talk) 20:56, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

A quick request: could you check if the template correctly works under Internet Explorer?

Sure; meanwhile, my attempt to reinstall the {{{color}}} option doesn't seem to be working... could you check to see what typo/mistake I might've made...?  Thanks, David (talk) 21:02, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...Font-size seems okay, but as I'm not a regular IE user I wouldn't say for sure (e.g. I noticed some other (presumably unrelated) effects, but perhaps that's because I don't have IE (v6) configured...)  Yours, David (talk) 21:08, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...{{{color}}} seems to be working fine now; thanks for your recode!  One further request, if I dare: Have you noticed how the header isn't aligned with the centered body text below it...?  Can this be rectified...?  David (talk) 21:11, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

...I find one of the most distracting things about navigation boxes ...to be that they ...that have all kinds of different shapes and colours within a single article...

Agreed; the issue arose when I was converting the "Gibraltar topics" template to {{Navigation}} format (here) and felt I ought to preserve the (pleasant) background colo/ur used. Any immediate thoughts re the header's apparent slight misalignment...?  David (talk) 21:21, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

The misalignment is caused by the space taken up by the show/hide and edit buttons. It most likely can be fixed with some extra CSS code. —Ruud 21:24, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Looks like the widths used by the "navbox collapsible autocollapse" class and {{Tnavbar}} need to be made the same somehow... finding/amending the class, however, is probably a little too advanced for me at present... David (talk) 06:08, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

...Just to report/confirm that this problem now seems to be solved, though I see there's now an IE6 problem with {{Tnavbar}}...!  Best wishes, David (talk) 22:52, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] {{Dynamic navigation box}}

Hi, I reverted the template back to your last version, but it is still broken. If you "Hide" the contents, clicking on "Show" fails to restore the box. Also, I think it looks very ugly to see "[Show]" or "[Hide]" jammed immediately in front of the box's title — it looked much better over on the right hand side of the title bar. At least the font is a reasonable size now! (And yes, I did clear my cache to check it out.) Thanks, Andrwsc 21:36, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

I'm just using plain old IE6 (no derogatory comments please ;). Yes, I have the same problem with {{Navigation}}. My test page is Toni Sailer, which has five boxes back-to-back. Loading the page for the first time has all boxes closed; clicking on "[show]" generates a script error. The IE6 error dialog says:

Line: 500
Char: 14
Error: Could not get the display property. Invalid argument.
Code: 0
URL: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toni_Sailer

Let me know if you really need a screen shot, and I will see what I can do. I've made several thousand edits, but never uploaded an image before... Andrwsc 21:58, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

After your most recent modifications, the show/hide functionality is working, so that's good! There are still three noticable differences from the old version:

1. The show/hide control is now on a line by itself in the title bar, so that the title is now twice as wide. Can the show/hide button be moved back to the right-hand side of the bar?
2. The font size of the box contents is now 100%. Previously, the title was at 100% but the contents were at 90% (I think). That seemed to be a good choice.
3. The "COLOR=" parameter for the title bar no longer works.

Thanks, Andrwsc 23:05, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Are you still working on the javascript and CSS classes underneath these templates? There are still some major changes compared to the version prior to a few days ago. First, the location of the "show/hide" control is in a terrible spot, jammed in front of the box title. It really needs to move to the left hand side, as it was. Second, the box now appears to default to open, when it should be closed. Pages that have several boxes strung together at the bottom are now a big mess because they all default open. Third, the color and width specification are ignored. Lastly, the font size for the contents of the box used to be 90%. Thanks for looking at this. Andrwsc 22:57, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but I won't be able to fix everything this weekend. I haven't been able to figure out why the show/hide control is misplaced; some quick test with similar tables under IE6 placed them correctly. I will the tables dafualting to open in the next hour. I will not reintroduce the ability to change the color and width of the navigational boxes: navigational boxes should have a consistent look (see User:R. Koot/navbox for some good/bad examples). The font size should be 90% (e.g. I haven't ben able to reproduce this bug), but will get myself access to a comuter with both IE and an internet connection to make sure everything works correclty under that setup. —Ruud 17:31, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Ok, thanks. I'm most concerned about the show/hide control location, and having the boxes closed by default, so I'm glad you've prioritized those first. As for the width, I thought 94% was the most common "standard", and that is what I'm trying to restore, but I'm not going to insist on it. As for the color, I understand your point, but I'm uneasy at removing this functionality altogether. I agree that some infoboxes have had some hideous colors! In my case, working for Wikipedia:WikiProject Sports Olympics, we've been using #BFD7FF for the thousands of instances of navigation boxes on the Olympic pages. Personally, I prefer that shade of blue than the purple default. (Where did that come from, anyway?) Perhaps the ideal solution would be to make it a user preference, like the selection of image thumbnail sizes (e.g. default 180px, but changeable), but that seems outside the scope of what can be done here. It would allow users to personalize their colors, and also ensure that all navigation boxes have a consistent appearance. Andrwsc 18:06, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Autocollapsing has been fixed now and I'm working on the positioning of the show/hide button. I'm not advocating that all navigational boxes should look as to what I'm changing them to look like now (in fact I dislike the that shade of purple as well). The place to change the appearance would be MediaWiki:Common.css where I have defined the .navbox CSS class, however I think would be smarter to make all navigational boxes look consistent first and only then to start arguing about how they should look like exactly. It is already possible for users to customize the look of the navigational boxes using the .navbox class by editing their personal style sheet. Yours is located at User:Andrwsc/monobook.css. Regards, —Ruud 18:15, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

The autocollapse behaviour seems to be the same as before – that is, not quite working. If there is a single dynamic nav box on a page, it does not autocollapse when the page is opened. If there are more than one, then they all do, which is good.

Thanks for the tip on the personal style sheet! Andrwsc 23:27, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

responding to your comment on my talk page Unfortunately, I don't think a "one size fits all" policy works with respect to the autocollapse of nav boxes. For example, (for better or worse), the Olympic pages often have rather large nav boxes to go from one nation to another. Recent Games have ~200 entries! Look at the end of Netherlands at the 2004 Summer Olympics for an example. (You can also see why I'm keen to see the 90% font size on the contents.) I had been using this template in the assumption that it would be closed by default, not realizing that it was a conscious decision to keep it open if it was the only box on the page. In my opinion, the decision of whether it should be open or closed by default ought to rest with the editor of the article and/or nav box, not some global policy. Not all nav boxes are the same size... Is there any way this can be made as an over-ride parameter, perhaps? That way, I could add code to {{NOCin2004SummerOlympics}} to force it closed by default, and editors of other nav box templates could make similar choices. Thanks, Andrwsc 21:08, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

STATE=collapsed — Excellent implementation! That is exactly what I wanted the template to do, so thanks for that! The only remaining issue I have is the triangle instead of "[show]/[hide]", but I see you're working on that. Andrwsc 17:10, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Template:NavigationBox

Hi, please take a look at this request. Thanks. NCurse _work 15:48, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Image tagging for Image:Navbox-klm-after.png

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[edit] MediaWiki edit buttons

I don't know if it was one of your edits, but it looks like you have more experience with this than I. Currently, the edit button above the edit window continue onto a second line; there is one too many buttons. I don't know if this happens on all browsers, fonts, and operating systems—I guess it does not happen on yours—but regardless it is an aesthetic error that thousands of people are seeing right now. Also, the icon for the External link button has changed from a normal blue gradient to an alarming diamond exclamation mark. —Centrx→talk • 05:36, 8 November 2006 (UTC)