User talk:Mark Dingemanse

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[edit] Bantu

Mark, thanks for your note on my talk page, I must have forgotten to watchlist Bantu. I have not quite figured out how the notice board works but will look at it again & thanks for the sytematic bias page info. Best, Chris Lowe Ngwe 07:28, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mail, what mail!?

No, actually. When was this? Was it something desperately important? A once-in-a-life-time job offer? A confession that you are in fact nigeriamajor and you invented the whole thing for a bit of attention? A sad story about how your rich uncle just died leaving you with millions but you need a "small" sum of money to access the inheritance, which you promise to share with me? CIA documents and pictures that prove that the US is ruled by a race of reptilian aliens? Or was it something else? Zyxoas (talk to me - I'll listen) 16:34, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Those are some very nice conjectures; I am, of course, not allowed to comment on them. Also, let me say this dont not place my Nigerian relatives in bad light I say stop them insult you recist.

No, it wasn't that important actually. I just thought I had sent you a recent paper on Bantu lexical reconstruction by Schadeberg, but apparently you changed your email address (no longer at webmail.co.za?). If you email me, I can reply (the Email this user function won't let me attach pdf's, obviously). Cheers, — mark ✎ 17:59, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Oops! Yes, I did change my email address. I've sent you a personal message. I'll try to see if the Webmail account still exists (they probably closed it weeks ago due to lack of activity). Thanks for that. Zyxoas (talk to me - I'll listen) 19:41, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

I did receive the email, and I sent you a reply. Did you not get it? Zyxoas (talk to me - I'll listen) 21:33, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

Ah yes, I did get it just after I had placed a notice on your talk. Thanks! — mark ✎ 06:43, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Woordjes Turkana

Beste Mark,

Een bijdrage waar iemand anders iets aan heeft, is dit niet, maar ik zou graag weten of je mij kunt helpen met een paar woordjes Turkana. Ik ben schrijfster, nu bezig met een 'vliegende doktersromannetje' tbv van AMREF Flying Doctors, en een van mijn hoofdpersonen heeft een Turkana-achtergrond. Het boekje moet zo snel af dat ik de taalkunst die je aanbeveelt miet meer kan aanschaffen, maar ik denk dat jij hem hebt. Zou je mij een grote lol willen doen en me een paar woordjes leren? 'Hoe gaat het?' 'Goed' (of wat daar ook de begroeting is - misschien is het 'Is er nog nieuws?'), 'Dank je wel', 'Tot ziens' zou al heel mooi zijn.

Héél erg bedankt, mede namens de oostafrikanen die wij middels dit boekje aan een betere gezondheid willen helpen...

Lydia Rood

Beste Lydia,

Ik heb op het ogenblik geen directe toegang tot een Turkana woordenboek of grammatica, dus voor nu verwijs ik je toch door, en wel naar een artikel dat volledig online te bekijken is. De volledige bronvermelding is:

• Ohta, Itaru. 1989. 'A Classified vocabulary of the Turkana in Northwestern Kenya'. African Study Monographs, Suppl. 10: 1-104.

De online versie vind je hier. Op pagina 78-79 vind je begroetingen, en met behulp van de index aan het begin zul je een schat aan andere handige Turkana woorden en uitdrukkingen kunnen vinden. Veel succes, en als je nog vragen hebt hoor ik het graag. — mark ✎ 11:37, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Dank je wel!! Inderdaad, een schat aan woorden en uitdrukkingen! Bijna jammer dat ik niet bezig ben een taal te leren, en alleen maar een paar woordjes nodig heb... (Maar ik heb voorlopig mijn handen vol aan het Marokkaans Arabisch, dat jij ook al schijnt te spreken. Man, wat ben ik jaloers op jou!) Hoe dan ook, ik ben je erg dankbaar. Hartelijke groet, LYDIA

Graag gedaan hoor! Zo veel talen spreek ik overigens niet; er zijn veel manieren om je als taalkundige diepgaand bezig te houden met talen die je nochtans niet (vloeiend) spreekt... Ik ben blij dat ik je heb kunnen helpen. — mark ✎ 09:43, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thanks

Thanks for your support. Everyking 19:20, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Naturally. — mark ✎ 20:09, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Belated thanks

Thank you for participating in my RfA. Consensus to promote was reached, and I am now an administrator. I'll be using the tools cautiously at first, and everyone should feel welcome to peer over my shoulder and make sure I'm not doing anything foolish. --Robth^Talk 04:15, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Maraba Coffee

Hello! As you're a Wikipedian interested in African topics, I'm writing to notify you that the Maraba Coffee article is now a 'Featured Article Candidate'. Please feel free to evaluate the article and write your support or opposition at Wikipedia:Featured article candidates. Thanks — SteveRwanda 15:09, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

As a matter of fact, I was already checking it out and seeing if I could vote there. But thanks for the note. — mark ✎ 15:23, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

OK, well done for keeping such a keen eye on things! And thanks for your support. — SteveRwanda 16:00, 19 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Utendi wa Tambuka

Hi Mark, I started a stub on the Utendi wa Tambuka, a very early Swahili poem. Right now it's in rather miserable condition but I'm continuing to research and add to it bit by bit. I don't know if Swahili is among the languages you're particularly interested in, but I thought I'd drop you a line about it. Best, --babbage 21:41, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, very interesting! I might be able to help out; I've put some notes on the talk page. — mark ✎ 06:17, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Wow, awesome work on Utendi wa Tambuka! ☺ --babbage 18:35, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Halo's RfA

Mark Dingemanse... Thank you very much for the constructive criticism in your oppose comment in my request for adminship. Ultimately, no consensus was reached, and I failed to be promoted, but I am very grateful for your coments. I will strive to better myself in all areas, especially Mainspace. Thε Halo Θ 23:49, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Kanga na kitenge

Sorry for the delay. Have replied there. --Ezeu 09:01, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Asante sana! — mark ✎ 14:35, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Feedback for essay

Hi, there. I have made some large changes to the essay now known as Wikipedia:Administrators are not only here to build the encyclopedia (I renamed it as the original title deviated too much from my original point). I would like some feedback on whether you find it more acceptable now. Thanks. Cowman109^Talk 18:44, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Replied over there. — mark ✎ 19:09, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Swahili literature

I've just started the article. Please contribute. -- Szvest 00:47, 27 September 2006 (UTC) ^{Wiki me up ®}

[edit] Ephraim Amu

Hi, I'm afraid I don't speak Ewe. I often look through the smaller wikipedias to see how they're doing and noticed the new articles in the Ewe Wikipedia. Good luck getting it started! Tigershrike 21:48, 30 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ethiopic Semitic languages

Roughly one year ago you moved a page to Ethiopian Semitic languages instead of Ethiopic Semitic languages which I think would be a bit more PC. I was curious as to why you did this although there were recommendations to the contrary on the talk page. I know you probably don't remember, but just in case... --Merhawie 18:42, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Hello Merhawie. Yes, I do remember that move. I moved it to 'Ethiopian Semitic' because that seemed to be the most common term, although I indicated that I had come across 'Ethiopic...' too. I documented the move on the talk page (Talk:Ethiopian Semitic languages#Ethiopic?), in response to a question by Mesfin. The 'recommendations to the contrary' I cannot find; I believe I brought in the suggestion that 'Ethiopic...' might be a possible title too but no-one else suggested or recommended it at that time.

However, on rereading that particular discussion I admit that I wasn't very explicit about my reasoning when I finally moved it to 'Ethiopian Semitic'. That unclarity has been rectified however during the more recent debate on the name of the language grouping (Talk:Ethiopian Semitic languages#"Ethiopian Semitic"). Note that Yom (whom I regard as knowledgeable in this area) also states that the term 'Ethiopic' is 'older' and 'now out of use'.

Do you think 'Ethiopic' would be more appropriate? — mark ✎ 20:42, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

I realized that the 'contray' thing that I was talking about was you after I posted, sorry :). But yes, I think that Ethiopic would be better just because Ethiopian implies that the languages are spoken only in Ethiopia...this was generally the case until Eritrea succeeded in reversing the Ethiopian occupation. Ethiopic seems to me to be a term in favor because it does not mean Ethiopia but at least alludes to the geographic area. Anyways, do you have a problem with me changing it to Ethiopic? --Merhawie 21:04, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Well I'm certainly not dead set against it, but I think the motivation is wrong. I do understand that 'Ethiopian' may leave the wrong impression but if it is the most common term, we simply have to use it, so Manual of Style stipulates. Moreover, Wikipedia should be descriptive, not prescriptive.

As I said on Talk:Ethiopian Semitic languages, it would certainly be a good idea to add a note to the article detailing the origin of the name 'Ethiopian', and explaining why it seemed a good term when it was introduced but less so nowadays. But I would tend to think that should be enough. However, feel free to move it if you feel justified. Although you might want to raise it on talk first to see what others think about it. — mark ✎ 18:29, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

ALright, great, thank you for your responses...time to hit up the library and do some research! --Merhawie 18:31, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] sanity check requested

(I stumbled upon the Ottoman in the cellar, looks like we could use it here. — mark ✎ )

Hi Mark, Long time, no speak. I've upped my editing over the past couple weeks and get the distinct feeling that there are a lot more disguntled long time users than there used to be. I keep coming across users on wikibreak or with manifestos demanding policy changes (one I've adopted), though it may all be a function that I'm simply not used to the uproar after all that time blissfully editing in the main namespace recently. So I need a sanity check - French Revolution or normal Sturm und Drang on the wiki? Anyway, I should probably go to back to my Darfur pages for sanity's sake. I hope that you are doing well. - BanyanTree 03:11, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

Hrmpf, speaking of sanity checks, can you get me one? I'm having exactly the same feeling as you have. You know, I appreciate your message. I've been reading and thinking a lot about these matters over the last few months, and one simple reason I'm silent about them is that I as a non-native speaker find it quite difficult (and time-consuming) to put into words my thoughts on such issues (and when I try, the result is usually disappointing).

What to do? Worldtravellers' suggestions certainly touch upon the right string, as does the campaign for less bull more writing (check WP:BULL). It's not a bad idea to 'go back to your Darfur pages for sanity's sake' — after all, in our neighbourhood it isn't too difficult to WP:IAA (Ignore All Assholes).

BTW, I'm not much editing these days because I'm busy in real life. I intend to pick up on Kanga (African garment) and Utendi wa Tambuka soon, however. Kwa heri ya kuonana! — mark ✎ 20:37, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

The perfect antidote to wiki-ridiculousness is the real world, so you're on the right track.

That post in your third link (you know the one I mean) may have been my most shocking moment on Wikipedia. I hope you won't be offended if I say that, in retrospect, I find it hilarious in an odd way. On this topic, and since I appear to be in a reflective mood, I learned about Xed way after the fact. I can't say that I'm surprised, but my interactions with him over the Congo conflicts were certainly some of the most enjoyable moments I've had on the wiki, as the discussion immediately jumped up a few intellectual notches.

I'll see if I can detach myself from the Main Page and go back to the Darfur pages. On a related and very positive note, Alex de Waal, editing as Adewaal, made a brief appearance and wrote a brilliant lead to Famine. I don't want to think what it would have cost to hire him to do the same work. Anyway, it's really good to touch base with you. Take care, BanyanTree 23:38, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Forgive me for butting in, but I have Mark's discussion page on my watchlist. Sadly, even our neighbourhood isn't the haven it once was. It's gotten me accused of neo-colonialism on the one hand and anti-Europeanism on the other. But, yeah, I can retreat to write about more rulers of the Duala and not have a worry in the world. I too have considered taking a long wikibreak, but in the end, I agree with Geogre. If we don't write about our particular areas of interest, no one will. And then the encyclopedia will go further toward being the world's biggest repository of Dr. Who trivia and Star Wars character biographies. — BrianSmithson 23:46, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

I hate to be the one to point this out but, due to those mean folks at Commons, we now appear to be discussing putting our feet up on a large Eurasian empire. (See image) I kinda like the surrealism, and my original post in the archives is now hilariously confusing. - BanyanTree 14:21, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Ha, that's just hilarious! I don't know where the original Ottoman has gone, but I can live with its replacement. Maybe it goes to show that we shouldn't be hanging around here but rather book a lengthy vacation to somemplace on the Mediterranean coast...

And Brian, I recognize what you're saying about our neighbourhood. I remember that debate we had on Talk:Igbo_people#Igbo_origins where the word 'Eurocentrism' fell. And some six months ago a Nigerian editor asked me "Why do you already want to bring down poor africa... dont you have a soul to judge you". In fact, I think I do have a soul to judge me, and that day it told me that I was spending too much of my valuable time on Wikipedia fighting pointless fights. On the whole however, I think the atmosphere in our neighbourhood happens to be quite agreeable still, and I also like the fact that there are some great new editors with us (people like MikeGasser, Yom, and HRH for example). — mark ✎ 12:27, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Thank you for supporting my RfA

Thank you for supporting my RfA that I have passed with 73/2/1.--Jusjih 09:48, 27 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] barnstar

		The Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar
		For many contributions with limited reward, I present you with this Random Acts of Kindness Barnstar. Sharkface217 00:38, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Couldn't add a legend to IDP's_in_Northern_Uganda.png

I added a legend to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:IDP%27s_in_Northern_Uganda.png but then found that I couldn't upload it. How strange! The wikipedia says "there is no file with that name". I think it's because of the ' in the name of the file. Maybe it's a bug in the mediawiki? I was then going to change the name of the image to drop the ' but I couldn't find a way to rename it either. Maybe that has to be done by an Administrator. Jeff Carr 19:41, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Endangered languages

Hi Mark,

Good catch. I have a confession. I used WP:AWB to find articles linked to Endangered language. Then as I was processing the list, I tried to read the text to see if the article really did describe an endangered language:

• On a few pages, the artice described both endangered languages plus other languages, which may have been either non-endangered or extinct. I added those articles to the category on the principle that if an endangered language is described (not mrely mentioned) on any given page, it is of interest to the category "Endangered languages."
• Moreover, I may have completely muffed a few as well. I hope those are rare.

I felt OK about doing this because:

1. I added far more legitimate pages than bad ones, and
2. more importantly, I'm making a commitment to go back through and check them.

Actually, I'm gonna totally populate the List of endangered languages page with every single language listed in UNESCO's Red Book. That will be in a couple weeks, though I may add a bit here and there in between.

I have noticed your name on many related pages. I sincerely appreciate your work.

Let me know if you have further questions. I hope my categorization didn't disturb anything.

Later, --Ling.Nut 12:57, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

• PS. Ah. I see by your edit summary that you think it is not best to categorize a group of languages within Category:Endangered languages unless all languages in that group are endangered. That's OK of course; I was just thinking (as I said above) that a category functions as a place to find further info, and should include a group in which some but not necessarily all languages are endangered. But I am far from being committed to this viewpoint. I was just thinking. --Ling.Nut 14:01, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

• Followup: I re-checked (from among those I added to the cat) all articles about a group of languages rather than an individual language. They all seem legit even by the stricter definition that you apply. An indeterminate case is Chibchan languages, which includes the text, "Most of these indigenous languages are severely endangered...". That doesn't say whether there are some that are "endangered" but not "severely endangered." I lean toward leaving this in the category, but please do remove the cat if you feel it is inappropriate. A million thanks!--Ling.Nut 14:13, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your replies and for double-checking. Yeah, I can see why it makes sense to have an article on a group of languages in the category even if not all languages of that group are endangered. I happen to have some background knowledge on the Maa languages (and to a lesser extent the Adamawa languages), that's why it struck me as an inappropriate characterization of these groups of languages. Maa especially is a clear case of a language family that is almost the opposite of being endangered, since both Maasai and Samburu are somewhat notorious for being the new language of many smaller peoples that have abandoned their own language (see Dorobo for example). And Adamawa is simply too vast a group to be characterized as endangered.

We may differ a little bit in our conception of the meaning and use of categories on Wikipedia but I think you made a good call in the other cases so far as I checked. Thanks for the agreeable way of handling these matters! — mark ✎ 21:21, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] African language map series

Can you please address the concerns I pointed out here, please? Since you made a number of these maps, I imagine there are 3 or 4 maps that will have to be corrected for the Nilo-Saharan languages Kunama, Nara, and Nubian. — ዮም | (Yom) | Talk • contribs • Ethiopia 18:03, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Replied over there. — mark ✎ 18:38, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Extinct & endangered African languages

Hi Mark,

The Extinct & endangered African languages sandbox is slightly more coherent now. There are two main sections: one is composed of several tables, and the second is the alphabetical listing that you may remember. The contents are not the same; they need to be merged. Moreover, the extinct languages need to be put onto a separate page (but that's another project).

Any time you have free time, here and there, feel free to drop by and fix an entry or two. I'm not asking for any big commitment; just whenever you have a free moment and want to do something different.

Thanks! --Ling.Nut 17:19, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the note, I'll see about tackling a red link now and then and maybe I can help cleaning up the list once in a while. Endangered languages are important. Best, — mark ✎ 20:30, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] linked refs for "speakers" and "ethnic pop"?

Hi again Mark,

Don't miss my message just above this one ;-)

You seem to know the people working in African languages. Can we get some sort of a consensus on (at least) two details?

Some (perhaps many) articles seem to have references sections that do not link back to the text of the article (see Zenaga language). I don't necessarily wanna be radical and suggest that every fact should be so linked (I think they should, but some folks will disagree). First of all, it clutters up shorter articles; second, some info is relatively stable; and third it might take forever to cite every single fact.

However, can we get some sort of consensus that really dynamic info (here I have in mind "number of speakers" and "ethnic population" should be fully cited and linked back to the appropriate reference? I think this info needs to be tracked more closely than some other facts may...

Thanks for your time, --Ling.Nut 18:03, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

I fully agree and this is a sensible proposal. Have added my voice over at WikiProject Languages. — mark ✎ 20:31, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Mark, I saw that posting of yours. I didn't want to reply in that forum because I didn't want to "hog the floor." I'm hoping others will have something to say as well.

I suppose this idea could be one project in the WikiProject Endangered languages and language revitalization (or Wikiproject Biolinguistic diversity.. or.. whatever).

Thanks!--Ling.Nut 21:32, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] New Picture on Logba language

Mark - I think you were a bit quick on the trigger there - i was still trying to edit the page but you cut in - go easy, I use this very rarely so have to fiddle a lot to get the effect I am intending. Anyhow I'll leave you to work out where to put the picture I have contributed. I think getting rid of the friends of Lodba link is a mistake - there are hundreds of good pictures there as well as videos with sound (songs in local langauge), but maybe you havent had the chance to look yet? A description of a language spoken by 7000 people without pictures sounds or people is pretty dry stuff you know! User:Excalibur (UTC)

Hi Excalibur,

I only wanted to help you, sorry for interrupting and for coming across curtly! As for the Friends of Logba link, I certainly didn't mean to imply that it's useless, just that it would be much more suitable in an article about the Logba people (as I said in my edit summary).

I did look at the site, by the way; but from the front page it is not clear where the videos can be found. After some searching, I found them on the page on Logba Tota Primary School, so I think the direct link you have added is a good solution. Thanks for that, Logba materials are quite scarce on the internet! — mark ✎ 18:04, 13 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Mark, I couldnt agree more - there can't be many Wikipedians (even abjectly poor ones like me) who have visited this charming spot, let alone spent long enough there to record its manifest delights. The idea of a "People of Logba " page is a nice one, but I'm afraid I would have to leave that to my very good friend and neighbour Aku Sika - as a native of the the village she knows a lot more about it than I will ever do. She is in touch with other Logbans (?) in the UK, so if you ever need any help on the linguistic side, I'm sure she could help. Hope you enjoyed watching the video as much as I enjoyed being there to make it!

By the way, although not strictly Logba, I picked up an excellent CD recording at the British Library on Friday of Ewe drumming and singing from Dzodze, Ghana - the website reference to this project is www.cepafrica.org - You might be able to use this or link it somwhere useful. And if you like any of my other photos at the friends of Logba gallery (just Google for it) please feel free to use them here - I'm not possessive.

Excalibur 14 November 2006

Hello Excalibur, thanks for the offer concerning the photos, it would be great to use some more. By the way, would it be possible for you to upload them in a higher resolution?

As for the videos, it was confirmed to me by a native speaker of Ewe that the songs are in Ewe, not in Logba. I suspected so much when I saw that the videos were recorded on a school. Thing is, there is much influence of Ewe on Logba, and education in the area is mostly in Ewe. So at school, they learn Ewe songs. (In fact, Rudolph Plehn already wrote more than a century ago that the Logba don't sing their own (Logba) songs.) Still, it's fine to put it up at Logba people since that's what they are. But regrettable, it's not the Logba language.

I have something in the works though; I think we'll have audio samples of real Logba in the article within a month.

Best, — mark ✎ 09:26, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Very interesting! Anyhow I'll certainly upload a few higher resolution pictures shortly. I might also take another look at the caves description - as far as I am aware there is only one cave and it is about 30 foot long with a rather small column, an aven, some immature gour dams and some very unimpressive stal and flowstone development. Its unusual because there is so little karst in Ghana, but in global terms its very unremakable. (I'm a better speleologist than linguist) - however the cliffs are truly spectacular by comparison. Excalibur 16:06, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Added a larger file version at [1] Excalibur 17:45, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Great! (BTW, you can link to images without including them by prefacing 'image'with a double colon, as in [[:Image:Logbagirlbig.JPG]], which yields Image:Logbagirlbig.JPG.) I have deleted the smaller one and changed it in Logba language also. Thanks again! — mark ✎ 17:56, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

No problem Mark: heres three more images to spice up the page:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Logbakitchen.JPG http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Lobgaschool.JPG http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Logbavillage.JPG

Hope you can use them! Excalibur 18:37, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bantu-Please clarify

I made an attempt at what I thought was the correct interpretation based on a cursory reading of Bantu languages and because the paragraph is talking about a single language (which I assumed to be proto-Bantu). This was apparently incorrect, but you have left the original confusion intact. Why is Bantu being referred to as a single language? Your help in clarifying this paragraph would be appreciated. Thanks. Ufwuct 21:15, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the note. As a linguist I'm used to the use of 'Bantu' as short for 'the Bantu family', that's why I didn't notice the unclarity. I have now clarified it. My problem with your original edit was that it suggested that Greenberg compared the hypothetical Proto-Bantu language with other (Bantoid) languages, which is not the case as Greenberg's method for his 1963 The Languages of Africa mostly involved mass lexical comparison of synchronic (as opposed to diachronic) linguistic materials. Regards, — mark ✎ 21:39, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

The proto-XXX reconstruction is the method I was most familiar with, so I perhaps didn't word it carefully enough in my edit, and just edited according to my biases. Thank you for your clarification. Ufwuct 15:32, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sukuma

Hey, have you been watching the Sukuma page? Someone's adding (poorly formatted) info that has a plausible ring to it, bt I have no idea if it's factual or not. It's certainly uncited.

Cheers, --Ling.Nut 23:44, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

I haven't. For now I have pulled out the additions because I feel we really are too lenient generally in applying WP:V. — mark ✎ 08:39, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Systemic Bias in Linguistics

Great list... I look forward to contributing to some of these. As for your other comment re: embodiment - I have added a cite in the article itself. Great to have discovered this group working on Systemic Bias... mukerjee (talk) 07:25, 18 November 2006 (UTC)