Talk:Belgrade
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[edit] Various
Why is 2003 added to the time that Belgrade is the capital of Yugoslavia? Will it no longer be the capital after 2003? -- Zoe
- It will still be the capital, but Yugoslavia will no longer exist - it's being (been?) renamed Serbia & Montenegro. I had thought the name change occurred in 2002, though this isn't reflected in the Yugoslavia article - can anyone confirm? Enchanter
It will be renamed during the year,final constitutional confirmations are awaited from serbian and montenegrin parliaments...
After rigged elections in 2000 Belgrade was the site of major demonstrations which caused the ousting of president Slobodan Milošević.
Is whoever wrote this asserting that the elections were rigged, or is there a general consensus? If the latter, among whom? I assume more than one person says it, but more than one person says the same thing about the elections here that year, and it would still be POV to declare it baldly somewhere. --Charles A. L. 16:58, Feb 17, 2004 (UTC)
Socialists admited rigging!Milosevic didn`t.Avala
I replaced the photo and para removed by user:213.137.124.218 at 16:03, 31 Oct 2004 - it appears to have been removed in error. --Ali@gwc.org.uk 19:34, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Pictures
The format of this article is starting to get a little out of hand. I'm going to attempt to rearrange the multitude of photos that have been posted by contributions: Kris12, so that they fit into the structure a little better. Perhaps someone who actually knows what they're doing could help out a little :) Dupz 01:10, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
- I'll try to help... Wikipedia isn't picture gallery, picture gallery of Belgrade is here. --Dijxtra 11:20, 13 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] an addition to the history
1944 The Americans and other allies bomb Belgrade On October 20, Belgrade was liberated by the People's Liberation Army of Yugoslavia with help of Russian Red Army The new communist government arrests and liquidates political opponents, and mobilizes Belgrade youth, sending them to the Sremski Front source: http://www.beograd.org.yu/cms/view.php?id=201239
[edit] Location map
What's happening with it? --estavisti 09:53, 4 December 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Etymology
Can someone confirm the remark about "beli" also meaning "east" in Slavic? In Serbo-Croatian I know the modern word for east is istok, and my Slavic lingustics professor has previously remarked that the meaning of Beograd was indeed "White town". In Russian the cognate only means white as well, not east, so I suspect the remark about it possibly meaning "East Town" may be erroneous. Nonbonumest
- Igorsr - You are right about word "beli" - it only means white. Word for east is "istok". January 28, 2006
[edit] Cyrillic alphabet
How is Belgrade written in the Cyrillic alphabet? Edward 23:16, 2 February 2006 (UTC)
- Београд - Dupz 11:49, 3 February 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Capital of Serbia since when?
What does this mean?: [Belgrade] has been the capital of Serbia since 1404...
Serbia didn't exist as a formal political entity from roughly 1459-1526, 1527-1804, and 1922-1941 and therefore cannot have had a capital (See: History of Serbia). In addition, Serbia had other capitals after 1404 (See: Capitals of Serbia).
[edit] Capital of Serbia indeed
It's true that Serbia didn't exist as a state for longer than 3 centuries but Belgrade remained its last real capital (Smederevo was leveled to the ground). It became a mecca for the Serbs during 16th and 17th centuries, when it was one of the biggest European cities, counting over 100,000 people. Culturally it never ceased to be the capital of Serbia, not even during Turkish rule, even though legally Turkey was a centralised state. Serbs have never stopped looking at Belgrade as its capital city, rather than Constantinople of course. Belgrade was the capital of Serbia under Austrian occupations (3 times), and finally when Serbia declared independence in 1806, with Belgrade its capital. It would be the same as if you said that Athens (next to Constantinople) hasn't been considered a capital city by the Greeks, it's simply not true. Therefore, I support this timeline, and so does the city government (in 2004 Belgrade celebrated 600th anniversary of its capital city status). Serbia may have ceased to exist for 300 years, but teh Serbs themselves surely haven't.
[edit] Nighlife section
Would anyone object to minimizing the night life section, as this is supposed to be an encyclopedic article, not a tourist guide describing every place to hang out in Belgrade? --dcabrilo 00:21, 25 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Wikiproject Belgrade
I created it: Wikipedia:WikiProject Belgrade --HolyRomanEmperor 18:26, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Quotes
The quotes section is rather POV. All of the quotes kind of glorify the city and they are certainly not well balanced. So, just like with photos, we can put on a good or a bad quote, thus introducing a POV. I suggest we sack the entire section (there is wikiquotes for that anyway). --dcabrilo 06:49, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] ;)
Thank you for this fantastic article, it is very informative and precise. You have described Belgrade in such a way that I can’t wait to come and visit it. BTW I really like the section about nightlife, and I think the text shows us that it is an important part of modern Belgrade, and please don’t «minimize» it! Is it true that Belgrade won the title ‘City of the Future’? We don’t get much information here in France about it; so if someone could write about it, that would be nice.
[edit] True;)
Belgrade has won the competition in the category of South European City of Future, after previoisly holding the title of "South-East-Central European City of Future". Belgrade got selected because of its cheep but qualified labour force, low prices and big investments, as well as the standard of living which is one of the highest in this part of Europe (there's a big gap between Serbian North, where Belgrade lies, and its poor South:(). New pics have also been added to this article, the city needs some good marketing after a very tough decade.;) Belgrade became popular among Ex Yugoslav nations as "Sin City"- where you can party your a** off without spending as much as in other Central European capitals; clubbing became one of the new brands of the city. Belgrade is also expecting a big boom in investments in the years to come, as it approaches the EU. City of Future Article User:NeroN_BG
- Also www.fdimagazine.com. Can someone put this link into article b/c my Firefox with Google Toolbar breaks due to extreme article size. Shinhan 17:24, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Pictures & Layout
There is a problem with pictures in the article and the way they affect the layout in wide windows on reasonably high-res screens. For example, "Geography" section starts with a huge gap to accomodate the two pictures from previous section(s). Perhaps we should do some of the following:
- Eliminate some pictures which don't add value as they are now
- Move the pictures from the floating right strip to their own galleries, perhaps even their own articles
- Reduce the size of thumbnails - they are rather large by Wikipedia standards
- Move all right-hand images into first-section and let them span as far as they need (essentially reserving right side for those images only), something like in History of computer hardware in the SFRY
We should also improve pictures. If anyone can take fresh/better pictures that would be nice:
- Kralja Milana Street picture is rather pale
- "The Victor" picture is really not the picture of the Victor, but of New Belgrade. Victor is to the left, headless (head is out of the picture)
- Despot Stefan Tower picture is also rather pale, I could try editing it but it would be better if retaken
- Map of municipalities only includes numbers that have to be looked up from the list, leaving a huge white gap. I'll see what I can do, but if anyone has a better, ready-made solution, please yell...
--Aleksandar Šušnjar 16:49, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
Here... Should others like the retouched versions better, we can use them instead of the originals:
| Original | Retouched | Notes |
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Levels & gamma correction |
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Levels, gamma correction, time-stamp removed, top-left corner glare |
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Done from scratch based on information found at Elektronski plan Beograda. This map does not, however, account for suburban municipalities but is more geographically accurate (I overlaid it on top of satellite images to create it). |
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Levels, gamma correction, removed window reflection of lens visible in the center of the picture |
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Levels, gamma correction, removal of time stamp |
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Done from scratch, in standard Wikipedia style. |
--Aleksandar Šušnjar 17:17, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
- I agree, the retouched versions look much better. And the map: you could put the detailed map of the city proper somewhere at the top of the article, and the old map in the municipalities section. Хајдук Еру (Talk || Contributions) 02:07, 2 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] October 5
I can't find free pictures for this event, and think it would be nice to have some in the article. Also, number of demonstrators should be in the text (half million, million... I cant remember). For now, I put external link with nice photos. Lakinekaki 17:06, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] OK
Well done on the article, it's really perfect. Let's nominate it for a Featured Article. --serbiana - talk 02:33, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Silly, isn't... We want Belgrade to be futured article, near great article like Berlin. Belgrade must wait long time to reach quality for futured article. --Pockey 12:39, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Coming from someone who lives in Belgrade... I'm surprised... --serbiana - talk 18:29, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
Sure, I am always frank. My place of living is not important. Belgrade article must be much better. --Pockey 18:52, 13 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Universities
I was under the impression that there is no "University of Arts", only "Academy of Fine Arts". If it is so it should link to Academy of Fine Arts, Belgrade. Also, I added external links to all universities that don't (yet?) have their own page at WP. According to Government information website Military Academy URL is www.vojna.akademija.mod.gov.yu which does not exist. So no link for them. Shinhan 12:02, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
- There is also an University of arts - http://www.arts.bg.ac.yu/
--Luzzifer 21:10, 18 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Belgrade Metropolitan Area
Most cites over 1 milion population in Wikipedia have seperate page about their Metropolitan Area.Should we create such page about Belgrade Metropolitan Area?If you agree,I think that such page should contain official suburban municipalities like Lazarevac and unofficial suburban municipalities like Pancevo. User:BoDu 14 August 2006
[edit] Central Europe
"Old Belgrade is situated in South-Eastern Europe, with one part on the Balkan Peninsula". Please stop vandalising the article. Balkan peninsula and Southeastern Europe are synonyms so this sentance does not bear any rational meaning. Vojvodina indeed belongs to Central Europe and so does Zemun and even New Belgrade, the latter however only geographically. To check out the borders of the Balkans see Central Europe, Balkan peninsula etc. Balkan peninsula reaches Sava and Danube which is where it merges into Central Europe. User:NeroN_BG.
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Luzzifer"
- Thanks for the advice. And? Sorry, man but you are absolutly wrong. "See the article Central europe, Balkan peninsula". Balkan is not the same es South-Eastern europe at all- the borders of Balkan peninsula are Sava and Danube, the borther of south-eastern europe is the northern border of Serbia (Vojvodina), as well as of Croatia. Sorry, that educational system let you down, that's why we have Wiki. :)
pozz, --Luzzifer 10:08, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
Retrieved from "http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:NeroN_BG"
Type in Southeastern Europe and it will redirect you automatically to Balkans. That's proof number one, 'man'...?? [1] This is the website of the Stability Pact of Southeastern Europe/ the Balkans region, also known as the Balkans Stability Pact. [2] Website to the Center for Democracy and Reconciliation in Southeast Europe/ Balkans [3]- covering Balkan countries
One thing is political map and the other thing is geographical terms. I'm sorry if this is too hard for you to comprehend, I understand that you have a limited "storage" capacity, however that's not my problem to deal with. Geographical, cultural and historical terms prove my point. Political terms however surpass the Balkan borders well into Central Europe (Carphatian basin, Pannonian plain- and so in political terms the areas such as Vojvodina, Transylvania, Pannonian Croatia and sometimes even Slovenia are considered South-East or Balkan-european, which does not correspond to their historical, cultural and other ties)
So I don't know where you came up with all those missconceptions about this area, but it's pretty evident that you are lacking a significant, if not basic, amount of info to start with.
And, one more thing... that same Wikipedia that ur trying to involve into discussion is going to confirm my claims, so feel to check not only Wikipedia but every other encyclopedia that you can think of:) Thank you for your comments, enjoy your enquiries User:NeroN_BG
I'm really sorry, but you are wrong. Historically, borders of Central europe were borders of Austrian empire. However noone consider today not, Serbia, but even Croatia to be an Central European country. Any case, you wrote, that Zemun (ok) and NEW BELGRADE belong have Central European culture. I cannot ignore political meanings becuase the TERM South-Eastern Europe is only 10 years old, and was made of political reasons. Croatia claimed that it cannot be a Balkan state since the half of it is not on the Balkans. Romania complaind that it's concidered to be a Balkan state and only 5% of it's teritorry is on Balkans. That's why new ter was found out whicj includes NORTHERN CROATIA, VOJVODINA and ROMANIA as well.
) --Luzzifer 17:53, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
Well, I've visited all that sites. Just an advice. Sometimes it's goog to read articles as well, not only to memorize maps.--Luzzifer 17:54, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] ?
- First things first. Your sentence "Noone consideres Serbia nor Croatia to be Central European" is no argument whatsoever and doesn't offer a rational explanation nor covers your arguments. Nonetheless it depicts a lack of the latter. Northern Serbia and Croatia are indeed Central European, first of all geographically, according to the Danube-Sava-Kupa line which separates the Balkans from the Central Europe, not to mention culturally and historically. Transylvania of Romania is a Central European part of Romania, since it is located west of the Carphatian mountains, which form Central Europe's eastern border, also without mentioning cultural and historical arguments that there are plenty of, as in Serbo- Croatian case. Eastern Part of Romania, Wallacia and Moldova are considered Eastern European, while Dobruja region is a Balkan, or southeast european region of the country. Political map, on the other hand (type it on Google if you don't understand what it means) counts these areas as a part of Southeastern Europe or the Balkans, which indeed makes sence because today these areas are unified and represent a one whole; so in that case they are beeing perceived differently, wrong if you look it from the geo-cultural-historical aspect. You can go pretty much both ways however ONLY in political terms. BUT since political terms represent only a slice of a country's identity which is basically determined on its geographical position, history, culture, religion, neighbours, climate etc there are no reasons to fight those arguments. If you chose to perceive a country through political perspective only your results tend to be inconclusive and wrong, because ignorancy and uninforminess of the one sided view makes you see a totally misshaped image. I have to say I feel sorry for you if you think that's the way to be.
p.s. Could you please translate this for me: "That's why new term was found out which includes NORTHERN CROATIA, VOJVODINA and ROMANIA as well"....???? User:NeroN_BG
[edit] PICTURES OF BELGRADE
There are so many nice pictures of Belgrade, these on this site are among the most awful I've ever seen. Do we really have to accept ugly picture of Kalemegdan tower etc. I even think that someone has been puting so ugly pictures on purpose.
Take a look at Zagreb page. Pictures are grate there. --Luzzifer 20:21, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
They are absolutelt terrible. I hate this site. --82.117.194.34 23:42, 17 September 2006 (UTC)
Ovo cu reci na srpskom, jer me je sramota da kazem na engloskom. PREMA DATIM SLIKAMA NA KOJIM NEKO OCIGLODNO INSISTIRA JER IH JE SAM SLIKAO, BEOGRAD IZGLEDA KAO SELO. Stidim se ovog sajta. --82.117.194.34 16:23, 5 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] RV, explained
Religious architecture and architectural projects under construction have both been moved to subpages. Standard and Evropa - haven't even heard of the former, to call the latter popular would be stretching the outer reaches of credibility. As for the medieval names, why remove them? --estavisti 21:56, 15 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Tourism & Media
- Borba is still coming out, their site is at http://www.borba.co.yu/.
- NIN and Vreme are by far the two most popular and respected newsweeklies in Serbia and Belgrade. This should not be deleted.
- One of the reasons the article failed its Featured Article nomination is that is was packed full of lists. So I don't see how pasting in a list from the List of notable buildings in Belgrade subpage improves the article.
- "In recent years growing numbers of young people, especially from Croatia, Slovenia and Bosnia-Herzegovina, have visited Belgrade to enjoy the city's nightlife." It's unclear why this sourced statement is being deleted.
Hope we can get a clarification on this soon, instead of more silent reverts. By the way, I don't appreciate it when I'm spuriously accused of vandalism, especially given how much work and time I've put into this article. --estavisti 00:59, 22 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Gallery
@Estavisti. When removing such large part of the article at lest give some argument, or edit wikimedia commons page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 89.216.183.250 (talk)
