Talk:Absolute (philosophy)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This article is part of the Philosophy WikiProject, an attempt at creating a standardised, informative, comprehensive and easy-to-use Philosophy resource. Please read the instructions and standards for writing and maintaining philosophy articles.

This page is an absolute (no pun intended) morass of pov (point of view). Please take a look at it and add contrasting views (if you have them). I'll try to tone down the POV, but even that is a humongous task... Cimon avaro 12:45 May 12, 2003 (UTC)

I have moved the article content to this talk page (see below), as I believe that this is not currently even remotely encyclopedic material. The Anome 13:05 May 12, 2003 (UTC)

---

Copied from my book A Simple Plan for Enlightenment, by Gustav Barnard, Copyright 1997. Permission is hereby given for Wikipedia to use and share this material. The book is available from me at P O Box 27608, Sunnyside 0132 South Africa, or gustav_barnard@absamail.co.za

The Absolute

In its simplest form the metaphysical concept of the Absolute is simple. It is not deemed to exist in a material state. The Absolute is unmanifested; in itself only pure potential.

In certain philosophical traditions it is held to be the basis of all of manifested creation, from the very gross to the very subtle. Creation is considered to stem from this uncreated potential according to this view. Here (which is nowhere, really) creation starts when the Creator releases the vibrations which form the essential building blocks of all of creation.

This is purportedly released into previously non-existing ether or space. This is claimed to be so because there was neither space nor time before creation as there was no before.

Space and time are considered a function of creation, as creation takes place, time and space are created. The Creator is considered to create using the Word of Genesis and of St. John, using AUM. This is a sound, a vibration that contains all vibrations or components of every created thing. Everything ever created in its finest aspect consists not of the smallest hard tangible building blocks but only of unique vibrations. And all these vibrations are contained in the original primordial sound of the Word or of AUM. So, the basis of all existence is vibrations, according to this view.

Many philosophers and mystics hold that we have an urge to understand creation. This we can achieve according to our ability to be aware. This is not solely an intellectual understanding because that is only partial understanding. This is so because, to accurately and completely see and describe anything intellectually, be it even the smallest and simplest of the atoms, hydrogen, is not possible. The intellect, wonderful as it is, cannot comprehend the subtlest of creation which is where the true answers are considered to be. The Absolute might have a simple basis, but its manifestations are complex. We cannot see all, we always see only in part. The greater part that we do not see is shrouded in ignorance. As we see more, we also see the expanding horizon of greater ignorance that this more knowledge has created. What we see is real, and partial and it always leaves greater vistas unseen. When we communicate the reality we see, we do so by creating concepts. By creating these concepts, we move away from the reality of what we want to describe; the concepts, which are our own new less complete created reality, take the place of the original object. Thus we move away from, instead of closer to, the object we deal with. Looking at the success of science in its journey to total knowledge, to the Absolute, we find that quantum physics is the field where scientists have gone furthest in understanding the essence of matter. To explain it better, let us start from tangible gross matter. This is composed of different levels of existence. Starting from say a muscle, we have the next layer being cells, then molecules, atoms, nuclei and electrons, after that a bewildering tour into the basic nature of subtle and more subtle sub-atomic particles, each subtler level forming the base or building blocks of the next higher one and each level with its own unique set of rules or natural law applicable to it. In the end, after a very long journey, the last “tangible” reality to be found is pure wave motion. This then disappears into and reappears from what scientists call the ground state of quantum physics at an exceedingly rapid rate. Here we have arrived at the boundaries of the physical world. Descriptions of this ground state given by intelligent, perceptive and intuitive quantum physics scientists sounds very mystical. They do not want to talk in riddles but, of necessity, like mystics, they have to. Some speak of this ground state as empty of matter and full of potentiality. It forms the substratum of all material in a non-material way. With a normal worldview, these descriptions do not make sense. In the end however, we get the message that the most solid we know is composed of, is bed-rocked on, the most non-solid. It is the same language, the same words that mystics use to explain the Absolute. So, we arrive at the conclusion that in the end nothing in the realm of the relative, of the created universe, is concrete or can be described accurately and specifically. The same goes for that field on which creation is based namely the Absolute or God. This is beyond description, it is the root of description, it always draws a circle around all descriptions. All descriptions of anything are partial and invite further description. Such a further description is more complete and still more partial. And so forth ad infinitum. When you eventually transcend the ad infinitum, then you have arrived at the Absolute and no more concepts nor descriptions are there, they are not available or desired. Then everything Is its total completeness, it is not only clear; it is the quintessential of clarity. Then we experience the only complete way of seeing. We know now that the Absolute is the ground state of everything and this includes not only the physics mentioned above, but all of human activity. In practical terms we are looking at Law for justice, Economy for right living, Wholeness for health, Religion for unity, Love for self-expression, and Harmony for manifestation of the Absolute. Here again words fail to describe the finest of these activities. It is totally possible to communicate this very subtlest, but that is not done with words. That can only be done directly, from person to person in the province of pure consciousness.

---

[edit] Should this article be merged with the Ultimate?

We have articles on both The Absolute and The Ultimate. Are they the same, different, partially overlapping, or different aspects of the same thing? Should these articles be merged? -- Karada 22:04, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

As purposed, and there was no opposition until now, and due to the similiarity of conceptions, I've merged the articles The Ultimate and The Ultimate Oneness. There is no necessity of having lots of minor articles scattered, when the contents make more sense to the user's understanding if put together. --Rosaecruz 17:40, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Disputed

Um.. Buddhism can be seen to have an Ultimate (Nirvana), but Buddhist nirvana is not that of the traditional soul/infinity/essence/spirit/rejoining/returning to be part of the universe nor is it trancending them. There are some infos to read on understanding buddhist views on Ultimate. Shunyata(emptiness or voidness), Anicca (Impermanence), Anatta (No-Self or Non-Self). These will clear out the misunderstanding views on the Ultimate in Buddhism. Buddhism sees reality as non-absolute or changing. Any thoughts before I remove the reference? Monkey Brain 02:51, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

How easily I had forgotten about how easily I can change the words to fit the right view. Monkey Brain 05:57, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Similar Concepts

Hegel's Absolute Geist (Spirit/Mind) is very reminiscent of Berkeley's God.66.82.9.54 18:07, 9 August 2006 (UTC)Lestrade